{ "episodeId": "SLP180", "speakers": { "stephan": { "name": "Stephan Livera", "role": "host", "tag": "STEPHAN" }, "stephan_livera": { "name": "Stephan Livera", "role": "guest", "tag": "STEPHAN" } }, "segments": [ { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "00:10", "start": 9.75, "text": "Hi everyone and welcome to the Stephan Livera podcast, a show about Bitcoin and Austrian economics. Today I've got an awesome guest for you. I won't spoil, but I'll, I'll firstly let's introduce the sponsors of the show. So firstly, check out Swann Bitcoin, the place to buy Bitcoin. If you're in the US, this is absolutely the place you've got to get your auto-stacking on. Now, disclosure, I- I hold a small equity stake in Swan, I'm an advisor, I've been working with the team. I think it's, it's, it's incredible because it's so simple, even a no-coiner could do it. You, you fund it with your US dollars from your bank account, you auto-stake your Bitcoin, and then you auto-withdraw to your cold storage. 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So that's, something everyone needs to be thinking about as we are, you know, if we're all bullish on Bitcoin, we think the price is going up, well, you've also got to think about your security. And now also if you need liquidity, friends don't let friends sell Bitcoin. You can put up some Bitcoin and get a collateralized" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "02:00", "start": 120.42, "text": "So, also remember that in that scenario, you can still hold one of three keys. So, it's a really great setup. Also, Unchained Capital are offering all sorts of open-source content, such as Hermit and Caravan, and also on their blog, they've got an incredible series there. I really enjoyed the recent post by Drew Bonsall, so go and check them out. It's Unchained Dash Capital dot com. Okay, so with that said, these are the sponsors for today's episode, and I'm just gonna bring in my guest. Welcome, Eric." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "02:31", "start": 150.64, "text": "What's up? What's up to all the people out there. Shout out to Stephan for having me on." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "02:37", "start": 156.67, "text": "Awesome, Eric. So, look, tell, tell us a little bit about yourself. I mean, you, you were the man on the TV screen, shilling Bitcoin. tell us a little bit about how you, how you ended up here." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "02:50", "start": 169.68, "text": "Yeah, it was actually funny 'cause I didn't think, I, I kinda thought they were live, but then I was like, \"They're not live,\" and I was like, \"There's no way they're using that,\" 'cause I saw the dude cut away. And when you see it actually happening, I, I get just enough out before he's like, \"Ooh, we gotta go, we gotta, we gotta turn the camera off of him.\"" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "03:09", "start": 189.06, "text": "But, I was at the, I was at the, you know, the Black Lives Matter protest in Hit me up, that day, and he said you wanted to head out, so I was like, \"Yeah, let's hit City Hall, \" and I saw the woman out there, and she asked if I wanted to say something, and, I thought, \"Okay, I have a platform, I have this opportunity, and th-this is the best thing I can say, \" you know? And I, I prefaced that with \"macro solution\" because it's not the-- it's not a final solution. There's many minor details that need to be involved Protest sign is boycott the system, by Bitcoin. And so that's what, that's the, was the best, that was the best thing I could say. That was, I was like, I got a platform, I gotta get this message out there, we gotta get a change going, and this is the nuclear option of, of boycotting. As you know, in, in America, boycotting is-- and in the Black community is a, very powerful tool that we've used several times, as a form of protest. And so I wanna introduce This form of protest, to everyone at large and especially the Black community." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "04:25", "start": 264.57, "text": "That's, that's fantastic. I think, I, I think the first reaction I had when I was watching that clip was, wow, like how quickly you a- you were able to, like, pull it all together into a nice cohesive statement that, really just kind of, in, it was like two or three sentences, and then you just, like, because, look, for people who aren't familiar, if you're, presenting, there's always, th-that pressure is on you To, deal with that." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "04:52", "start": 291.73, "text": "I'm not gonna lie, I was, I was nervous, but it's, it's that speaking truth to power, it's understanding What needs to be done and how it, not, and al-almost how it needs to be done, but I, I knew I had to. I, the thing with, the thing with boycotting in, in America is we're, we're actually really-- we, we know how to fight the system, and we know that fighting the system is in America, in, in, in, anywhere, in, in our current ti-times right now, fighting, you know, crony capitalism or vulture capitalism, and it's how do you, you know, you hit 'em in their pocket? And, you know, yeah, I, I, you know We are under a system of oppression and, you know, by race, by finance, and by so many other subtle means, and, you know, this is the one way. This is, this is one of, this is, this is our hammer in our toolkit. To say, or maybe our, our multi-tool in our toolkit, but this is a huge, huge tool in our toolkit, and I knew that this was the tool that I had to present with the little time I had." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "06:01", "start": 361.08, "text": "That's incredible, man. so look, let's, let's back up a little bit. I wanna hear your story in terms of how you got into Bitcoin. What was it about Bitcoin that appealed to you?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "06:10", "start": 370.33, "text": "So here, here's a funny story. So I actually got into it. my boy, he has a, a pretty decent presence on," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "06:20", "start": 379.63, "text": "Ben Armani. and he got me into Bitcoin. He was, he was one of my friends who was like always on the cutting edge of technology, like, you know, he was showing me video on phones before it came out, and, you know, even with music, he was like, \"This music genre is gonna be big.\" And then he just mentioned it with Bitcoin, like, I re- I believe in like 2015, he was like, \"Dude, this is gonna be huge. You gotta get into this Bitcoin.\" And, you know, I shrugged it off, I didn't really pay attention to it, and it came back around, I think in 2017, for some reason I just, I, I don't know, it just came across my mind and I downloaded the Coinbase app then, and I just saw the price at $700. And this was in, yeah, about like 2017, 2017, I believe. And then I looked at the app again, and it was $1,000. And I was like, \"Holy shit! This thing's moving. So, you know, I dipped my toe into the water, I put in fifty bucks, I kept reading, and then you just go into the black hole, and then you just start finding any amount of like money you can. But at the same time, I didn't wanna be a hypocrite, you know, if I was gonna support this thing, you know, I had to understand the technology as best as I could, and when I had the means, you know, I had to get a node up and running, you know, I, I, Nas has this statement, You can be about it. And so to the extent of my capabilities, I'm about it as much as I possibly can be." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "07:52", "start": 471.77, "text": "R-R-Rip didn't though. He went to the dark side. He's a, he's a bee catcher now. But, yeah, he got me into it." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "08:01", "start": 480.54, "text": "Yeah, that's, I mean, I, I was gonna say because, as I understand, I mean, a lot of people in the libertarian world like him from the libertarian perspective, but not necessarily about from the bee cash, point of view, obviously. I'm not but I'm curious, what was it about your learning that made you decide to not go the B Cash pathway?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "08:23", "start": 503.33, "text": "I think my unique skill set is that I have a, I'm really good at finding information. Like, my dad was someone who'd watch the news all the time. When I was a kid, I was like, \"Why is my dad always watching the news?\" But that quality is inherent in me, where I'm like a noosehound, and I'm really good at like hunting down and sniffing out the smartest people in a room and the best information. And I just kept coming across information, and the smartest people in the room just were saying Bitcoin, Bitcoin, Bitcoin, and the smartest devs in the room were working on Bitcoin, and it didn't take too much for me to figure out that, you know, that you probably wanna hang out with the smartest people in the room on this one. So, you know, that's where I'm at. I feel like I'm with the smartest people in the room." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "09:18", "start": 557.57, "text": "Man, that's really clever. And I, I think it's, it's quite a difficult space as well when you're first learning about it, because there appear to be many different smart people in the room, right? And it's like, which one do you follow? Who do you, who do you, who do you go with, if you will? so tell us a little bit about your journey then, in terms of, learning how to And open arms and the boys will be very happy. Tell us about that." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "09:44", "start": 583.77, "text": "Yeah, it's just, you know, being, crypto Twitter, you come across these guys and then you, you hear like lightnings coming out, then lightning actually comes out, and you wanna get involved, and you come across these dudes, and they're like, \"Look, for two hundred and fifty bucks, you can be up and zippin' on this whole project.\" And, you know, \"I found an old one terabyte hard drive.\" and my, my, my node is so bare bones, like I don't even have the LCD screen. I'm an, you know, I'm a, I'm a penny pincher, so I, I don't even have the LCD screen. I just literally have the board. I use my computer to SSH in, you know? So I just, I found an old one terabyte hard drive, I said, \"Okay, I can kick down sixty bucks on a Blitz,\" you know? And, God, it was just-- it really, if, if you're just a, a Which didn't really make that much sense to me, but the software was criminally simple to set up, set up, and, you know, OpenNoms is on, he's on the, the, the Telegram all day just helping people, which I don't really know why he does it, I would pull my hair out. But he's just so selfless in his ability to help the community, you know, answering the same questions. Like he, he helped me several times. I was like, \"I can't get this to work,\" and we're like texting back and forth, \"Did you try this? Did you try that? Did you try this?\" You know? And it's just like, \"Wow, like these dudes are doing like such a great job,\" and, you know, the- One, I can su-support the community in a Telegram and answering the questions I know. Two, I can hit them all with a donation. And three, I'm supporting the network. you know, like when, so we're at version, zero point two o and Bitcoin Core. There's a script out for it already. All you gotta do is put the script in, hit enter, and you're updated. So these guys keep you on the cutting edge of technology. It's, it's such a great community, and these guys are like, it's, it's just part of the whole community as a whole that's making it happen, man. And I'm just really happy to just be a part of it." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "11:42", "start": 702.16, "text": "Yeah, that's such a beautiful thing about the Bitcoin communities as well. So we're-- so for listeners who aren't familiar, Raspberry Pi is, a node project, and so essentially you can, quickly set up your own Bitcoin node with a Raspberry Pi. And one of the cool things with the Raspberry Pi is it actually has a LCD screen on the, on the normal standard build, obviously, you don't have to do that as, as you didn't. and, the cool thing is it, it can run some of this software for you, or at So, tell us a little bit about what you use your Raspiblitz for." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "12:15", "start": 735.21, "text": "I'm mainly just to, right now, to support the network. you know, I think a lot, you know, I don't have, and, you know, to, just to be like reckless, you know, I, I don't wanna put a bunch of money on there right now. So, I, I-- There was points of it where I had like a bunch of channels, but to be honest, you know, with my, the current projects I work on, like I" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "12:41", "start": 760.96, "text": "Being a routing node, which I will eventually build up to, so I'm not a routing node, my node is basically to support, the Bitcoin ledger at this point and making sure that, you know, the ledger stays intact, at that, at, at this current point, but I eventually want to build myself up to being a routing node." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "12:58", "start": 778.08, "text": "Yeah, that's, that's, well, I mean, look, I think that's the other thing as well that, we've gotta be cognizant that not everyone's gonna go like full all the way, like it takes time, and for all of us, it's a progression journey. I certainly am not perfect myself, right? I, I had to work my way up on a lot of different aspects. so let's, let's talk a little bit about, Bitcoin as social movement, right? So I think, you know, I see it as a social movement, and I think you obviously see it that way too. Tell us a little bit about your views on that aspect of social change and driving that change." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "13:32", "start": 812.23, "text": "Right. So, we know that in the genesis block, we, we really know what it's all about. Like, you know, the Chancellor is on the brink of a second bailout. And I feel like that's Satoshi saying enough's enough, you know? And basically we have seen that the financial institutions we have now are biased towards the rich, you know? the, the, the big corporations never have to worry about getting a bailout. It's almost a given, you're gonna get a bailout. You know, the, the, the citizen, citizen, you know? barely if ever gets a bailout or, or they get a pintence of the bailout, and as a form of social change, you know, we have to become economically independent, and this is our on-ramp. So, you know, my, my call to the community as a whole, including the black community, was to say, hey, like, let's get on this on-ramp, let's, let's start studying it. I actually have a three-point plan. there's three points, and Bitcoin is, one of the first points of it. Which is what I said, we're gonna opt out and we're gonna start buying Bitcoin now. That doesn't mean, you know, dumping your life savings into it, but it does mean first learning the technology and maybe dollar cost averaging in, you know, put in what you can, even if it's five dollars, just, just become comfortable with it. And then the second point of that plan is volunteering, you know? Like, let's get back in the community, let's build these community bonds that we have, let's, let's start meeting people, let's start figuring out who the leaders And maybe you're one of the leaders yourself, but we gotta start building these community bonds. We gotta understand that we are each other, we have the same wants, needs, and goals. You know, we're, we're a human family, and what better way to express that than into volunteering and in your community? And, you know, one thing to note is that Bitcoin Overall, it's a voluntary project, you know? So that just speaks to the power of volunteering. And so I'm a huge, proponent of volunteering. So first is le-learn about Bitcoin You know, buy some Bitcoin, DCAN, dollar cost average N, and then my third point is, you know, let's not forget about the ballot box, that is, you know, th-those are, those are The macro tool sets, I believe that we can have, in this revolution that is underway. We can't-- there is no normal to go back to. There's nothing to go back to anymore. We gotta move forward. So, ballot box, volunteering, Bitcoin, and I believe that's, you know, like the trifactor of, you know, those are the macro ideas of the toolkit. And then, and within that toolkit, let's build these, these micro ideas." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "16:17", "start": 976.6, "text": "Great, and so you mentioned the ballot box, so what's your intention around that? Like, what sort of changes do you see that could be driven there?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "16:26", "start": 985.93, "text": "It's, it's really hard to tell, you know, 'cause, you know, you, at this point, we're trying to pick the politician that's gonna, you know, beat us up the least. At this point, but at the same time, you know, we-- there are, there are politicians who are out there to help us. I, you know, it, it's weird because you're, you're, you're-- it's like, can the system even change? You know? but at the same time, it's like, well, let's not put Donald Trump. At the head of it, you know, let's at least give us people and it'll give us some breathing room to effect critical change. And as far as the ballot box, I'm, I'm really into local politics. You know, like join your neighborhood council, vote, vote for your neighborhood council. I, I helped my homegirl Ziba, with her campaign, and she's on our community council board, you know? And it can be as easy as starting there, like vote, you know, vote for the director of your community center, you know? But if you have an You know, don't waste it, don't waste that, don't" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "17:28", "start": 1047.79, "text": "waste that, that tool. I like the focus on localism myself. I believe it's one of those things where- You can potentially find support across the political spectrum, whether you're a progressive or a conservative or a libertarian, you, you can make an argument there that moving things to a local level is just gonna be better for, for whatever you are. What do you think?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "17:52", "start": 1072.37, "text": "Yeah, definitely. I mean, you know, find people who share your same values and try to promote those people in places where they can put those values in place. I mean, because if you're not-- if, if you're not, someone else will, you know? So Hopefully it's, it's your values and your, and your shared values that you want promoted, in, in those structures of power." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "18:15", "start": 1095.29, "text": "Right. And I think the other way to think of it, al-also, is that if it's somebody in your local community, if they live near you, then They feel more of a connection to you, and you feel more of a connection to them, whereas if you are-- so, I mean, I'm in Australia, but obviously the, the federal politicians are, you know, they're hundreds of kilometers away, in, in, and in America, it could be even, you know, it could be well, they could be very far away, and they're impacting-- those decisions are impacting you and your community. You'd, it, it, it's much better to kind of give more power to the local areas as opposed to the federal" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "18:56", "start": 1135.6, "text": "Definitely, and, you know, that's, that-- those are the politicians. You, you want the politician that lives in your neighborhood to be representing you, not the politician who doesn't do their own laundry or their own dishes, you know?" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "19:09", "start": 1149.2, "text": "Yeah. A-and speaking of, police and the police system as well, there may be parallels there also, this idea of having police who are from that area, And, different structures around how, policing could be improved. Do you have any thoughts on that? I presume you do. Yeah," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "19:29", "start": 1169.18, "text": "definitely. Definitely. So, I, I volunteered at my local, recreation center. I was a basketball coach. Now, mind you, I don't know I don't know any technicalities about basketball, so I chose the youngest kids to coach, and my goal was to make sure they had a great time, to make sure they felt supported, and to make sure they felt like what it meant to be a team, and to actually pass-- kids at that age, five and six, you just want them to pass the ball. But, We had, they had a program in which a local police officer would visit the community center, and the kids would become acquainted with the police officer in the center and get to know him on a first name basis. And I think that's the connection we need. Like, as long as a police officer feels that he's not related to you, you're not his cousin, you're not his brother, you're not his brother's or sister's friend, then, you know, that, it, it, it makes- That disconnect that much more powerful for them to maybe inflict harm upon you. Now, we have a huge policing problem, in this country. Our, our policing is actually The foundations of it is built on slavery and slave patrols and, catching slaves and, and supporting the status quo. you know, so in the north it was for the protection of property and goods, and in the south it was for the, you know, the monitoring of slaves and catching runaway slaves, so, you know, policing the slave, the slave population. So That's why, you know, Bitcoin as a whole is a, a huge part of the tool, because we essentially have to upend the status quo. And I think that falls into maybe, not even maybe, it falls into an economic dimension of this. But, yeah, our, our policing system in America is, it's really, it's really bad. So, you know, but there, there are programs, there are people, you know, putting a foot forward, in that. But, yeah, we, the, the micro idea For that, or as I mentioned, I volunteered, I was in a position to meet the police officer and to have communication with that police officer as part of the program to integrate the police in the community. So we can do it, and, there, there are steps being taken forward in, in my community for that." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "22:02", "start": 1321.67, "text": "Great. And so you mentioned volunteering, and so you mentioned, being a basketball coach for a youth team. Are there any other forms of volunteering, that you see that you would like to promote?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "22:16", "start": 1335.82, "text": "A ton, I, I wanna get back into it. I got really busy. I, that was, enormously, an, a, enormously, fulfilling experience. For me, you know, you go to the grocery store, you see your kids running up to you, and they're still calling you coach. it was a very fulfilling, experience for me, but I'd love to volunteer, in the Bitcoin community with, you know, maybe contributing-- I mean, that's, that's a huge, far off dream, but I'd love to be able to contribute code, you know, volunteering, my time and towards a, Bitcoin maybe Lightning project. And, in the city of Los Angeles, now there's a webpage where you can do a myriad of, of volunteer opportunities, like just planting trees, you know, being a mentor, you know, taking kids camping" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "23:06", "start": 1385.83, "text": "Yeah, that's a, a really good way to think about it, and I think it, it just brings it down to what's going on in your community and what, what can you do, and I think a lot of Bitcoin people see that, and I think it's a fair point you make as well around, wanting to contribute to these Bitcoin and Lightning projects, and I think the really interesting thing as well is You don't necessarily need to be some super computer genius person, Bitcoin is for all walks of life, and, you know, even I'm not a developer, you're not a developer, but we're still, you know, doing Bitcoin stuff and kind of promoting Bitcoin. So tell us a little bit about that idea, Bitcoin being for all walks of life." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "23:47", "start": 1427.34, "text": "Yeah, I mean, that's, you know, the, that's one of the tenets, you know, it's open, it's an open, platform where all you need is an internet connection. And, you know, a part of it is people who maybe not technically inclined, can spread that message, you know? And that's, that was part of me, my reason of spreading that message, when I was being interviewed, you know, it's, it's for all walks of life, and, you know, it's not Hard to get involved. So it just takes the, initiative and people like me and, and you and others to just keep talking about it so people get interested in it. I mean, you know, my family wants me to shut up about it, and I've, I've gotten my little sister into it. I've gotten my- older sister into it and she unfortunately lost her, twelve letter passphrase, so fingers crossed she finds it. But, you know, it's-- and it's also things like that when you talk to people about it, you realize that like for those who know a little bit less than you, that how it can be difficult for them. So it's also, you know, just Figuring out ways you can help the community and get the community on board. But yeah, it's, it's open, it's, it's for everyone, and all you need is an internet connection and a, you know, a smartphone, and you can start participating and then figuring it out." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "25:05", "start": 1504.95, "text": "Right, that reminds me of my friend Matt O'Dell's uncle Jim, right? You have to, you have to be the uncle Jim for your family. Yeah, yeah," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "25:11", "start": 1511.29, "text": "yeah. I'm definitely that dude. Like, they just want me, like, shut up." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "25:19", "start": 1518.64, "text": "So, Eric, let's hear a bit about you. I, you mentioned you're an artist. Tell us a bit about what you're doing, in that world." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "25:26", "start": 1525.86, "text": "Yeah, so I'm working on a documentary right now. It's called Hip Hop Philosophy. it's about a DJ in Ace the P D, he has a show on the internet called a, a Monday Night Fresh, you can go to his webpage, Hip Hop Philosophy, that show streams live, California time, it usually starts around six PM, his thing is that he never plays the same song twice, but he, he plays music from a, a specific era, so it's kind of interesting how he continually finds new music, and, you know, his angle for the whole thing too is that he's a community resource, and he's volunteering his time to provide the hip hop community with new music because he doesn't like the watered down music that he hears on the radio or that you hear. I know in America you hear the, You hear the same song all day. but, something you might, you might, find, interesting is, my group Time Machine, back in our day, we, we, we had the album of the week on Triple J. our album Slow Your Roll. this is- This might even be before your time, because, we got interviewed by, Maya Jupiter. That's when Maya Jupiter was on the, radio. So this was like 2000- 2003. In 2006, we toured Australia. 2006, we toured Australia. I think we did a club revolt in Mel, in Melbourne. there was like this 24-hour club back in the day that went on in Melbourne, so, we did that. We did Sydney. It was dope, man. We was out in Australia there. Yeah, man, Australia frickin' rode for our album, man. So yeah, we had album that we gon' triple D, that album will slowly roll. so, you know, I" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "27:14", "start": 1633.5, "text": "That's awesome, man. So, what's your role in, in the, i-in the music? Like, do you help? I'm a writer. Are you a writer? I'm a writer." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "27:22", "start": 1641.97, "text": "One of the writers for the documentary I shot and, I'm, I shot it, I'm, I shot it and I'm editing, editing the documentary now. it's, it's not, it's funny, like, the way I get into projects is like, I just think it's not gonna be, you know, all-- Like," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "27:43", "start": 1663.04, "text": "You know, four years of shooting and now I'm into like the first year of editing, but I feel like it's, it's, it's something I wanna, I want hip hop culture to have as a whole. I just feel like this story n-needs to be told, you know, for, for the hip hop community to have" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "27:59", "start": 1678.63, "text": "Yeah. so tell us a little bit about your writing process, like how do you, like, kind of take the ideas and put them into, you know, put them down into like your format, like what's your process there?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "28:10", "start": 1690.22, "text": "I like to-- I'm, I'm a very beat-driven listener. Like, even when I listen to music, I'll hear an album a thousand times and, and then it'll dawn on me, it's like, \"Oh my god, he said that? That's what he was saying?\" 'Cause I'm always listening to the beat. The beat is I'll get on board after that. But, you know, the B is just like a wave, you know? It's like, \"This is your wave. If you catch this wave, then, you, you know, you ride out. You gotta ride out on that wave.\" I think, In the times we are now, I think it's important for artists to have work that conveys some type of message. and, and you don't have to, but I think, you know, if, if, if you can, if you have that ability to, you should. so, you know, my, my music isn't, doesn't always revolve around, social change, it revolves around like parties, partying and bullshitting too. But, yeah, you know, just as an artist, like, you know, that's our responsibility," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "29:10", "start": 1749.72, "text": "my group. So he just sends me beats, you know, and that, that's our friendship. It's like, hey, what-- here's a beat, you wanna write? Yeah, I'll write to it. And, you know, that's, you know, it's, it's our creative outlet now. It's not, it's not my, My focus right now, the, the documentary and, m-making that film. So I'm not like, I'm not touring or anything, you know, I'll do a show here and there, but, you know, it's just, it's a, it's a great creative outlet, for me to like get some ideas out of my head and, you know, have fun with the beat." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "29:38", "start": 1777.87, "text": "Yeah. And so on the production side, on producing, how did you get involved into that? Was that just kind of being around the space and then you were like, \"This is a new challenge for me, I wanna take that on\"?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "29:49", "start": 1788.73, "text": "Yeah, I used to, well, for, for documentaries, I, I, I used, I used to make fan videos, using found footage. And I don't know, I was, I was like, if I'm gonna listen to a song, like me, if I hear some, a song and I like it, I'll play To it. So I just started, I started out on Microsoft Movie Maker, and it was just such an organic progression, was like Microsoft Movie Maker, and then my, you know, you're in LA, so you're definitely around filmmakers. So some, you know, your boy kicks you down his old, like, Mac tower with a ton of, like, with Final Cut Pro and Adobe After Effects, you know, and then you just, you just graduate into it, and then, you know, with the documentary, my boy was a filmmaker, and he was like, \"Look," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "30:34", "start": 1833.8, "text": "why documentary, and so he's kicking me down like, you know, three thousand dollars worth of equipment whenever I need it, and it's kind of a no-brainer at that point where if someone's gonna give you three thousand dollars worth of equipment, damn it, I'm gonna use it, you know? And that, so that's how it happened. It was super organic, it was super organic." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "30:53", "start": 1853.4, "text": "That's cool. so what's the plan then with the documentary, like when is that coming out and everything?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "31:00", "start": 1859.82, "text": "Man, so the documentary will probably come out the end of next year. I'm still adding it. the tentative title is hiphopphilosophy dot com. there's an IG handle called hiphopphilosophy movie at the moment that you can just see updates on it. But I gotta say, this guy AC, he's one of a kind. if you're into hip hop, you gotta check out his Monday night press show, Satoshi dot com. just look that up. We're Hip Hop Philosophy Radio, Monday nights from six to ten. I guarantee it's gonna be music if you're, if you're into hip hop, it's gonna be music you never heard before, and if you heard the song, you never heard that version of the song before. So the dude's a character, it's never a good time to turn the camera off. he's such a character. So," }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "31:43", "start": 1903.49, "text": "awesome. So what era of music, like what era of hip hop is he focusing on?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "31:48", "start": 1908.15, "text": "So more of like the nineties era, like He, he focuses like, late '80s to early '90s. and sorry, late '80s to, to '90s, so early 2000s, 'cause our album came out, the Time Machine album came out, in, 2004, and that's when I met him around that time. And his music kinda sits in that pocket of like, you know, very vibey, very, very melodic, you know, instrument based." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "32:16", "start": 1936.03, "text": "Yeah. and I presume you're gonna take Bitcoin for it as well, right? What's up?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "32:21", "start": 1940.85, "text": "Oh, that's-- So that's my plan, that's my plan. It's like I'm only-- It's like I'm only selling it for Bitcoin, you know? So that's-- you can only get it for Bitcoin. Yeah, that's the plan, man. You know, killing it. Bitcoin auction." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "32:34", "start": 1954.03, "text": "So are you looking to use a payment processor, or are you gonna do like the whole BTC pay server, like what's your plan with that? Or you haven't, like, obviously it's, it's a while off, so you know, you probably aren't thinking about it. It's" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "32:44", "start": 1964.26, "text": "a, and you never know, you never know what technology will be around. You know? It's like we have keysend with the Lightning Network now, you know, like we didn't have that before, so it's like, hey, I might just post an address, you know? Keysend me, keysend me your Lightning, keysend me some Lightning, you know, Bitcoin. So" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "33:02", "start": 1982.11, "text": "Yeah, right. I, I suppose though, if they're buying from you, they would probably rather have the invoice though, because then they can say, \"Oh, proof of payment.\" Yeah, yeah, yeah," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "33:10", "start": 1989.98, "text": "yeah. So, you know, it's like whatever technology's around at that moment, you know, I'll hook up. You know, but that's, it's like, I mean, then, yeah, and that's the beauty with Bitcoin, it's like, well, you know, I can set up my own payment. Option, you know, for this, for this, for this product I'm trying to sell. So yeah, yeah." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "33:26", "start": 2005.74, "text": "That's cool, man. I, and I love that you're really trying to be like a, like cutting edge, you know, use the latest thing. Like, you're on a right, like, 'cause a lot of people, they're not actually running a node, they haven't like actually learned how to do this stuff. I think it's, I think it's really cool that you've, you know, like, you've gone to that level Looking, is this like a pre-funding kind of model as well, or is it just more like you're gonna make it and then just sell it? No, I'm just gonna make it." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "33:56", "start": 2036.1, "text": "I've already made it, so I just-- This is, you know, I'm just putting my own free time towards it. It's, it's a passion project, you know? I'm a creative person, you know? I don't- When I sit down and I'm editing, I'm just in a zone, you know, that, that's my happy place. You know, I don't need anything except the snacks around me and, you know, putting that puzzle together. It's like, you know, those people who work on those huge, like, thousand piece puzzles. Like, that's what it is to me. I got this huge thousand piece puzzle, and each night I sit down and I look at it and I start putting the pieces together, and that's my happy place, that's my meditative s-s-s- space, you know, I don't need, I don't, I don't need a financial for-reward for it. I just want really the hip-hop community to have it. I feel like it needs, it's part of the story, it's part of the canon, you know? And it, it needs to be there for future generations and current generations to see. That's all it needs to be. It doesn't need to be more than that." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "34:49", "start": 2088.71, "text": "Yeah, that's really cool. I like that. and so then, in terms of like your day job and stuff like that, what's your like kind of ma-main focus during the day?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "35:00", "start": 2100.2, "text": "so being, you know, we're in a financial crisis right now, so I'm, I'm working from home, but I work at a, a performance arts center, which is cool. It's kinda cool, like we're, we're going through our problems, with that space right now. But, you know, it's just, it's in LA, you, you have so many, everyone's an artist in LA. And everyone, if you haven't made it as an artist yet, you know, you got your like side hustle job. So, you know" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "35:29", "start": 2129.38, "text": "Subscriptions, for them, but it's actually a really interesting place for me to be because I had no idea how powerful actual theater could be. Like, you know, I've seen one-man shows that have actually-- It's like if you see a good piece of theater, you walk out of that theater a different person. I saw a show about Louis Armstrong, was called Satchmo at the Waldorf, and the play centers around his last performance. And he's in the dressing room and he's recollecting his career. And the guy who plays Louis Armstrong plays three characters, Louis Armstrong, Louis Armstrong manager, and Miles Davis. And the dude never plays the trumpet once during this like ninety minute piece of work, and you're completely captivated by the whole thing. And it dawned on me, I was like, \"Oh my god, like, oh, this is what theater is.\" So, you know, on that note too, it's like I try to introduce people to theater, \"You gotta see the show, you gotta see this play And I, I didn't, as, as an artist, I didn't, I, I neglected that aspect of artistry, and so it was important in me being there to just expand my mind as to, like, what artist, what art is and how powerful it could actually be." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "36:44", "start": 2204.14, "text": "Yeah, so it's like you've got all these different passions, and really it's just kind of, you're just sharing them with them, and, you know, Bitcoin is one of them, and art is another, and theater is another, and that's, that's all, that's what it's all about. So tell me, in terms of, bringing back to Bitcoin, what are you more excited about over the coming year or so? Are, is there any particular development you're looking at that you think that'll be really cool to see coming into Bitcoin" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "37:14", "start": 2233.84, "text": "I'm excited with the, with, the, with Lightning Network, they got this, I forget what it's called, was it the Elsats? Is that what it's called? Yeah, Elsats. Yeah. Yeah, they're gonna start using the, the, HCM, the, the HTML, I mean, I'm not, I'm, I might screw this all up, but they're gonna start using the, the payment protocols in HTTP, you know? that was neglected." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "37:40", "start": 2260.28, "text": "I" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "37:43", "start": 2263.28, "text": "You know, the, that, with the Lightning Protocol is trying to integrate itself into, into the web to make, to even, to simplify payments even more, you know, so that's interesting, and then the privacy with Noor and Taproot, that's gonna be super in-interesting, and, you know, I, I got this prediction, I'm, I, I can't be wrong, we're, we're almost towards the end of the year, but I really see Lightning going mainstream really soon, I really do. It's just a couple of more key innovations that need to take place" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "38:13", "start": 2293.32, "text": "This thing, I mean, I, I, I use my node, you know, I send, I send payments, I send donations, you know, I send donations to Roots and Open Arms, you know, and it's, bam, you know, it's right there, it's like low fees and, you know, it's, I'm using the backend software like Ride the Lightning, you know, to make these payments, you know, Lightning Loop came out, like, how sick is that? You" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "38:33", "start": 2313.17, "text": "know, it's just, it's, it's so fun, it's just, it" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "38:42", "start": 2322.18, "text": "That's really cool. Yeah, I mean, RTL is a great dashboard to manage your Lightning channels with. I haven't, done-- I, I've done like the, the channel rebalancing tool on, RTL as well, which is really, yeah," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "38:55", "start": 2335.26, "text": "that's it." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "38:57", "start": 2337.4, "text": "Yeah, it's really cool. so yeah, I think it's, you know, there's a whole community around it, and it's global, right? I mean, there's a lot of guys in, like, Europe and stuff, and America, some in Asia, like, who are all working on Lightning stuff and, trying to find ways to do something interesting. And I think, when I chat with, Rusty, who's the, who's behind Sea Lightning and the Lightning Spark, he's, he, he" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "39:25", "start": 2364.72, "text": "He kind of makes this analogy back to his Linux days, right? So every year it was gonna be, \"Oh, this is the year of the Linux desktop,\" and like it didn't really happen that way. But then if you look at what happened, Linux did take over, just not in the way we thought it would. And so it, it might be a similar thing with Lightning that, you know, people are just gonna keep plugging away, plugging away, building on it, and then eventually something somewhere kind of takes off and then people start using it, and it, you know, who Online paywalls as a way to kind of, change the way advertising and online distribution works. there's so many different ideas around that. Do you have any ideas on what you think it could be or what you're more excited about in the Lightning world?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "40:07", "start": 2407.23, "text": "I mean, we're seeing it being used as a messaging application now, like, you know, that we didn't-- I don't, I don't know if that was in the original thoughts of it, but now we're, we're seeing it to send as, as a way to send private messaging. to, to people. So, you know, what, you know, what could come out of that? That's great, you know? it's just, it's just, yeah, we, we, we really don't, you know, we have no idea something could- Completely out of this world, step up, 'cause we're, we're so in the beginning stages of it all. Like I remember, I had this modem to dial up to the internet, and I had to, it was like PPP, you had to dial PPP and dial like these command lines, and then, you know, then your phone lines buzzing and crackling, and you're finally online. And I kinda feel like we're at that stage now with the technology, where it's just like, you know, you're dialing in, you're still using command lines to, you know, and it's, it's just really exciting to be here on the, on the early phases of it. So, you know, something, something's gonna come along, who knows what, but, you know, there's so many great minds working on it, it's just, it's really fun to play with this stuff." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "41:12", "start": 2472.27, "text": "Yeah. and I guess in terms of your experience spreading it with your family and your friends, what have you found works best or doesn't work that well in terms of when you're talking about Lightning with them or Bitcoin in general with them?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "41:25", "start": 2484.62, "text": "I mean, oddly enough, money talks, and it's like, \"Guys, look...\" I'm either gonna be rich or I'm gonna be poor. But," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "41:36", "start": 2496.07, "text": "it's like, you might wanna take this bet, you know? Like, you might wanna-- This seems like a pretty safe bet. You guys might wanna take it. And don't come to me crying the blues, you know? When you-- when, when the, when the numbers get really high, and I, I warned you about this, you know? I'm trying to get you on before the train takes off. And hey, you know, there's a chance it won't, but there's a chance it And so I'm betting on being the right side of this bet, and I want you guys to be on the right side of this bet with me. You know, that, that's the, that's the bit, you know, like that's, that's the, that's the, Then that's the carrot, but you know, it's so much deeper, to get people, you know, there's so much more to it, but you know, just the, you know, the elevator ride pitch. That's my elevator ride pitch, you know, hey Don't miss this train, you know?" }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "42:25", "start": 2545.26, "text": "It's tapping into the FOMO, right?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "42:27", "start": 2547.34, "text": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, don't miss this train. If you're gonna go in, just whatever you put in, don't even look at it for three years. Just forget you even had it, you know? Hold your own keys. Hold your own keys, save your passwords, write it down, stash it. Don't you just walk away, that's it, you're done. But just get in, you know, get yourself, get in, you know. 'Cause there, my, my, you know, of, of my family, I'm the most technically, oriented one, so, you know, like, 'cause my sister's like, she just called me the other day and she said, you know, \"Oh, I, I found my password phrase, and I got two of 'em, There's zero transactions, but both of the, both four phrases are valid. And I'm just like, dude, I remember you writing it on a yellow sheet of paper, not a white sheet of paper. So, you know, like people, being responsible for your own money is a really new concept for a lot of people too. So, you know, it's that, it's that educational process, of getting them over the hump too. But yeah, that, that carrot, that dangling carrot is, hey, don't, don't miss this train." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "43:33", "start": 2612.68, "text": "That's awesome. So, look, I guess, have you got any parting thoughts for everyone, in terms of, you know, Bitcoin, Lightning, social movement, anything that you'd like to- Yeah," }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "43:43", "start": 2622.92, "text": "just my three point plan is, you know, we- I mean, look, we all saw what happened on television. and that's just what we see, that's just what was caught on camera. and we need to move forward as a society, culturally, and we, and, and- We, we need to do what we can. So one of the, the, the, the nuclear option of boycotting for me is Bitcoin. So please learn about Bitcoin. And then you don't have to like put everything you have in it, but start dollar cost averaging in it, like understand the technology, you know, find resources like this podcast to educate yourself on it. Two, volunteer in your community in whatever way you can, even if it's just an hour, like it's extremely powerful in fighting this problem we have of systemic racism and inequality in the world. Volunteer wherever you can. And three, if you are fortunate enough Enough to live in a society where you can vote, don't neglect that tool either. you know, it's there, let's use it. And those are the my three, that's my three point plan in moving forward. And those are macro ideas, if you know, micro ideas, if you're a detail guy. Please let me know, bring it to the table. What can I do? How can we refine this idea down? But those are the three ideas that's, you know, if I want anyone to get anything from this conversation, it's those three points and moving forward." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "45:17", "start": 2716.56, "text": "Fantastic. So, Eric, where can listeners find you online?" }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "45:21", "start": 2721.07, "text": "just go to my Twitter handle at iamthecharacter. and I have my links to my music there. I'll also be posting links to the hip hop documentary movie and, the progress I'm making on it." }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "45:35", "start": 2734.85, "text": "Excellent. So I'll, put those links in the show notes and, thank you very much for joining me, Eric." }, { "speaker": "stephan_livera", "time": "45:40", "start": 2740.22, "text": "Thank you for having me, Stephan. Thanks for, reaching out, man. I, I didn't know, I didn't know that. That, interview was gonna get posted, which I was like, \"For sure they're cutting that, dude.\" I was like, \"They think, they think I've lost my mind.\" I was like, \"For sure they're cutting that,\" but I was like, \"I, I got a platform, I got about thirty seconds.\" Hey, let's make this happen. So, you know, and I'm, and I'm glad the community, I'm glad the community took it well too, and, and is appreciative of it. So," }, { "speaker": "stephan", "time": "46:05", "start": 2765.11, "text": "thank you. Hey, hey, man, I think you did a great job, so, thank you. Hope you enjoyed the episode. Get the show notes at stephanlivera dot com slash one eighty for this one. I'm also trying to set up Eric with BTC Pay Server so he can do that for donations. Lastly, Eric gave me a music track to use as" } ] }